Wave Music Home
ReleasesCommunityYour OrderWave Music
ArtistsEventsDJ MixesShop

Wave Music Home


Home
About Us
Labels
Distributed Labels
Links




Search


Adv. Search



Subscribe


Email






Go Back   Wave Music Community Board > Tech Talk for Gearheads > Sound Installers and Manufacturers

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #26  
Old 10-12-2010, 11:46 PM
atf104 atf104 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 576
Send a message via AIM to atf104
I'd like to see another amplifier on the market that rates their power down to 12Hz. The reserves necessary to drive a load at that frequency is enormous and what makes the conservative ratings of the Thrive amps so deceiving.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-13-2010, 12:49 AM
soundmanshorty soundmanshorty is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Posts: 1,421
Nice

Quote:
Originally Posted by atf104

Rack lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by atf104
I'd like to see another amplifier on the market that rates their power down to 12Hz. The reserves necessary to drive a load at that frequency is enormous and what makes the conservative ratings of the Thrive amps so deceiving.
Thanks for mentioning this Adam and why you see our amps conservatively rated from 12 hz to 50K..

We never believed in the 20 to 20 ratings, we believe in designing and spec our products with a very wide, dynamic hifi sounding product that sounds good in any portion of a sound system, not just known to be good on subs, or high freq, it has to sound good in any band desired, subs, midbass, low mids mid highs or tweeters.

We use our products in hifi audiophile systems, studios ( a very famous nightime talk show on tv uses Thrive Amps on the monitors to mix the show) & obviously in night clubs

http://thrivesound.com/index.html

Last edited by soundmanshorty : 10-13-2010 at 01:05 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 10-13-2010, 12:51 AM
pbellsound pbellsound is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NEW YORK CITY
Posts: 644
Hey Nathan, you should send a Luna over to David Lee. He'll give it a good run-through and document DB measurements. It'll bridge into 4 Ohms or would that call for a Maya?

If he says it out-performs other amps, we just might have a new contender!
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 10-13-2010, 01:04 AM
shihp001 shihp001 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Posts: 254
I use Thrive amps for the past 4.5 years.
It has been very reliable, in fact, 3 of the brand new Crown 3600 vz went down within the first year.

I had the power switch replaced 2 times on one of the Thrive amps, and I got the parts free of charge within a week!

I like Thrive product and its perfect for my use.

But I can also understand what other people were saying about there is no specs on these amps.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-13-2010, 01:21 AM
pbellsound pbellsound is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NEW YORK CITY
Posts: 644
There’s enough basic specs to get somebody started. The biggest one has a 20 amp power inlet so we can extrapolate they draw 20 amps or less at their rated output and it has a 20 amp pop circuit breaker. Are these UL or CE accepted? If not, it’s not wise to use them in an installation as in the off chance they cause a fire, no insurance company will cover any losses.

I would wonder if they are power limited below a certain frequency to not exceed the 20 amp mains (as they are rated down to 12 Hz).

I’d like to see how they perform into some big power hungry subs compared to say a PL380, or an offering from Lab.gruppen or Studio-R.

Last edited by pbellsound : 10-13-2010 at 09:02 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 10-13-2010, 08:07 AM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbellsound
There’s enough basic specs to get somebody started. The biggest one has a 20 amp power inlet so we can extrapolate they draw 20 amps or less at their rated output and it has a 20 amp pop circuit breaker. Are these UL or CL accepted? If not, it’s not wise to use them in an installation as in the off chance they cause a fire, no insurance company will cover any losses.

I would wonder if they are power limited below a certain frequency to not exceed the 20 amp mains (as they are rated down to 12 Hz).

I’d like to see how they perform into some big power hungry subs compared to say a PL380, or an offering from Lab.gruppen or Studio-R.


Paul,

I am more than certain that 12 - 50 kHz is the frequency bandwidth. All amplifiers offer such ratings. They are located in the manuals. Manufactures promote 20 - 20,000 kHz in terms of frequency response. However, no professional amplifier is limited to 20 - 20,000 kHz unless the amplifier is all digital and limited based on the Nyquist rule. Why am I telling you this, which you know already?



Nevertheless,

The internal arrangement resembles my old Crests Professionals.

Who ever owns this company I would suggest you take down the internal photos of the amplifier or at least make them smaller. If I can find out the voltage rails by looking at various parts of the amplifier, I am quite sure someone who designs amplifiers can see much more.

Best Regards,
__________________
Elliot Thompson

Last edited by Elliot Thompson : 10-13-2010 at 08:09 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 10-13-2010, 09:23 AM
pbellsound pbellsound is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NEW YORK CITY
Posts: 644
Elliot,

You’d know more about the individual parts and their ratings than most people including myself. I agree, they are similar in construction to Crest amps. Not necessarily a bad thing. It’s very simple inside, what kind of protection does it have?

There appears to be many items that aren’t well secured. This amp may not survive long on the road. It certainly wouldn’t survive the Crown or QSC drop test.

I’d still want an experienced ear to beat them up next to other amps. Remember Elliot, the first & last lesson in SMAART is if everything says it’s good but your ears say otherwise, it’s not good.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 10-13-2010, 02:56 PM
John-Martin John-Martin is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Houston, Tx
Posts: 172
What's the difference between frequency response and frequency bandwidth?
__________________
Rane 2016S, CDJ-200s, Traktor Scratch Pro, Sony MDR-7506, Fostex PM 0.5 monitors.


My SoundCloud
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 10-13-2010, 09:42 PM
NathanShort NathanShort is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicago
Posts: 100
Wow this thread is still going....

I love Thrive Very very much, But it is not for "drop testing" nor is it meant to be beaten on the road.

It is for esoteric, mind blowing fidelity, in nightclub situations, and anywhere you want good sound.

It is full of absolutely premium parts all around, and not Value Engineered in the slightest.

I have only ever used Nyla, Syla, and Iona. For sub Bass the Maya was out of the clients budget.

Although I have a new OEM monster going through testing in our shop.....
It is full RMS rated at 2200w/pc at 2ohms WILL draw 30amps easily, oh.... and weighs in at about 79lbs. hahaha.

I have to say, while trying it on my new Faital 18XL1500 cabinets, each channel driving 2 drivers in parallel at 4ohm .... this amp PER CHANNEL kicked the snot out of a PL380 Bridged on 2 drivers. Killed it. We are going to have to go double wall on the sub with 13mm baltic birch as the drivers started breaking screwed and glued joints apart.

Nothing quite as crazy as the new 4000w per channel monster from the guys in India though. They are crazy..... And you need 30amp 220 to feed it... haha. It was somewhere on speakerplans forum.....
__________________
AIS Chicago-- System Designer/System engineer www.aisaudio.com

F
Freelance FOH/Monitor/System Tech/Stage Manager/
Stagehand Lead/Production Coordinator/Sound Enthusiast/Speaker Design

www.facebook.com/nathanshort
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 10-13-2010, 09:56 PM
NathanShort NathanShort is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicago
Posts: 100
Oh and also, we have taken our Syla and Nyla multiple times across the country from Miami to Brooklyn and all over Chicago, Nothing has ever broken, we did thermal the Syla once in the Miami sun, but that was quickly solved by a fan, at one rave we ran the Syla into a thermal it would not come back from, but that rave was literally 105deg f inside, we have since had the Syla modded with a nice fan. And this week it will go live its life out in Miami on a permanent install.
__________________
AIS Chicago-- System Designer/System engineer www.aisaudio.com

F
Freelance FOH/Monitor/System Tech/Stage Manager/
Stagehand Lead/Production Coordinator/Sound Enthusiast/Speaker Design

www.facebook.com/nathanshort
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 10-13-2010, 11:15 PM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by John-Martin
What's the difference between frequency response and frequency bandwidth?


Hi.

Frequency response is the measured dB or output power. If an amplifier says 200 watts per channel @ 8 ohms, from 20 – 20,000 kHz with no more than 0.05% THD, it means the amplifier can deliver 200 watts anywhere from 20 – 20,000 kHz.

Frequency Bandwidth is how high or how low the amplifier can produce frequencies. It does not mean the amplifier can deliver the same wattage as the frequency response. It just means the amplifier has the ability to play frequencies beyond 20 – 20,000 kHz if necessary. The wattage will be lower due to the limitations of the design. This applies to all amplifiers.

Loudspeakers follow the same principal. This is why there are –3 dB and, -10 dB figures listed on the specification sheet next to frequency response.

Best Regards,
__________________
Elliot Thompson
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 10-14-2010, 07:40 AM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbellsound
Elliot,

You’d know more about the individual parts and their ratings than most people including myself. I agree, they are similar in construction to Crest amps. Not necessarily a bad thing. It’s very simple inside, what kind of protection does it have?

There appears to be many items that aren’t well secured. This amp may not survive long on the road. It certainly wouldn’t survive the Crown or QSC drop test.

I’d still want an experienced ear to beat them up next to other amps. Remember Elliot, the first & last lesson in SMAART is if everything says it’s good but your ears say otherwise, it’s not good.


Hopefully the manufacture will create a PDF Manual for, showing the internals of an amplifier just brings forth more questions.

To my eyes, the faceplate always resembled a Crest Professional Series, with an LED array from the old BGW 750C. I cannot say I was surprised with the arrangement inside. It basically confirmed my assumptions.

I actually use my ears more often than viewing SMAART graphs and, use such illustrations to confirm my findings.

I am shocked Scott passed away. My thought patterns have shifted upon hearing the news.

Best Regards,
__________________
Elliot Thompson
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 10-14-2010, 04:19 PM
NathanShort NathanShort is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicago
Posts: 100
The layout of the amp might be similar, but only in the fact that having a tunnel for cooling, and keeping dirt out of the amplifier , is just a good common sense design.

The Transistors,their mounting, topology, pcb, rf filtering,limiting, output protiction, preamp stage,preamp power filtering, and ridiculously overbuilt power reservoirs and where they feed into the poweramp circuit, are all quite original.

Its like watching people fight over the folding of horns. Well, it is 2010 and there are only so many ways to fold a horn, port a box, and lay out an amplifier intelligently. I would take these in a flat black project box any day. The look is not for everyone, the road worthiness is not there nor was it designed to be road beaten. But they do sound like a dream, and when the money allows, are always going to be my first choice.

I had them in Level, here in Chicago for years (4 I think?) 6 days a week, about 6 hrs a night, full out House , Rap, and you name it. They never ever had a flaw. Crest CA 9 and 12's dropped like flies, Thrive never did.

Like any item, not for everyone, but for those whom have heard it, it beats the pants off of many many items.
__________________
AIS Chicago-- System Designer/System engineer www.aisaudio.com

F
Freelance FOH/Monitor/System Tech/Stage Manager/
Stagehand Lead/Production Coordinator/Sound Enthusiast/Speaker Design

www.facebook.com/nathanshort
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 10-15-2010, 08:20 AM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 430
You may be over analysing things for I don't see were the fighting came about.

It is merely talking shop. Once a manufacture takes it upon him or her self to offer the internal parts of their product for all to see, you will embark some that will comment on the components, or in this case the arrangement of the design.

It regards to Crest, it shares a lot of characteristics of the old Professional series in terms of how the components are arranged. Although no longer in production, Crest Professional Series is still classed as a highly respected design.

I don’t know any small manufacture would consider that degrading when there are lots of small companies mimicking amplifier arrangements from designs that are inferior to the Crest Professional Series.


Best Regards,
__________________
Elliot Thompson
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 10-15-2010, 09:15 PM
NathanShort NathanShort is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicago
Posts: 100
Hey hey, no fight here from me. I was just pointing out it is not some Crest Clone.
__________________
AIS Chicago-- System Designer/System engineer www.aisaudio.com

F
Freelance FOH/Monitor/System Tech/Stage Manager/
Stagehand Lead/Production Coordinator/Sound Enthusiast/Speaker Design

www.facebook.com/nathanshort
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 10-20-2010, 09:46 PM
NAVDEEP NAVDEEP is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 82
How about the powersoft K20 9000 W @2ohn dual 5200@ 4 ohm dual. that should fit your power needs !!! actually has anyone used these amps ???
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 10-21-2010, 12:55 AM
atf104 atf104 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 576
Send a message via AIM to atf104
I demo'd the actual system I just did with Thrive using Powersoft at the speaker manufacturer. They sound ok, but hearing the same speakers with the Thrive amps was like listening to a touring amp vs a hi-fi amp. No comparison really.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 10-21-2010, 04:35 AM
NAVDEEP NAVDEEP is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 82
So You a/b using Thrive amp vs powersoft amp ?? at the powersoft manufacturer ?? atf104 ??
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 10-21-2010, 10:15 AM
atf104 atf104 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 576
Send a message via AIM to atf104
Community Loudspeakers in Chester, PA. They had Powersoft in their demo room.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 10-22-2010, 07:16 AM
pbellsound pbellsound is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NEW YORK CITY
Posts: 644
Iíve reached my conclusion on Thrive amplifiers. No, I have not heard a one but I will accept the testaments of those who have and use them and have posted here.

Itís a fine amplifier and well built. It sounds and performs great. It has a very high continuous or ďlongĒ burst output, compared to other typical amplifiers of this day.

One might be able to match itís performance with a competing amplifier simply by choosing an amp of a higher power rating.

Although I havenít seen pricing across the line lately, I do recall seeing some pricing and it was pretty high.

This is a boutique item. Itís not for the portable or touring market. Few installs will have the budget to use it.

The unfortunate reality today is that price is king. The biggest market is sports bars. The sound companies bidding on them using the cheapest Chinese imported amplifiers and molded plastic speakers are winning the jobs. A sub? For what? Sound quality is secondary, the minimum cost job gets the nod. These places sound horrible.

Even the larger installs are won by cost. The sad truth is that todayís audience is what we refer to as ďthe IPod generationĒ where the lowest quality MP3 is the norm and DJís music is downloaded and played on a mixer run solid in the red. Iím seeing more and more DJís showing up with simply two IPodís. The audience doesnít know good sound from bad nor do they care. This is a sad and disappointing state but it is the sobering reality.

I would love to have the opportunity to do an install that has the budget to use Thrive amplifiers.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 10-22-2010, 09:11 AM
soundmanshorty soundmanshorty is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Posts: 1,421
Very tru, and

Quote:
Originally Posted by pbellsound
I’ve reached my conclusion on Thrive amplifiers. No, I have not heard a one but I will accept the testaments of those who have and use them and have posted here.

It’s a fine amplifier and well built. It sounds and performs great. It has a very high continuous or “long” burst output, compared to other typical amplifiers of this day.

One might be able to match it’s performance with a competing amplifier simply by choosing an amp of a higher power rating.

Although I haven’t seen pricing across the line lately, I do recall seeing some pricing and it was pretty high.

This is a boutique item. It’s not for the portable or touring market. Few installs will have the budget to use it.

The unfortunate reality today is that price is king. The biggest market is sports bars. The sound companies bidding on them using the cheapest Chinese imported amplifiers and molded plastic speakers are winning the jobs. A sub? For what? Sound quality is secondary, the minimum cost job gets the nod. These places sound horrible.

Even the larger installs are won by cost. The sad truth is that today’s audience is what we refer to as “the IPod generation” where the lowest quality MP3 is the norm and DJ’s music is downloaded and played on a mixer run solid in the red. I’m seeing more and more DJ’s showing up with simply two IPod’s. The audience doesn’t know good sound from bad nor do they care. This is a sad and disappointing state but it is the sobering reality.

I would love to have the opportunity to do an install that has the budget to use Thrive amplifiers.

thanks for looking at it this way, when we decided to start Thrive we wanted to design a product that was hifi for installs, we were not concerned of price competing with brand X chinese made products, where price point is concerned, we just wanted to build an incredible sounding product with highest quality components that is reliable with traditional designs and does more then promised.

We always had the idea with this line to go after a market that wants a hifi sound, that IS willing to pay for it. There are many club owners that ARE willing to pay for high end components today to raise the bar audio wise for there venue.

Everyone that has heard the Thrive Audio products loves the products we offer, the sound quality, reliability, and our vision. SBS clients, Nathans Clients, Adams clients, Recording studios and a major network late night talk show uses Thrive Audio to mix there show, this says alot not only about the brand but the quality of the line.

I do not agree on the idea that all of the audience that goes to clubs dont know or care about high quality audio, there might be some but not everyone. Too many clubs that have been built with killer systems are spoken about still to this day from the past, and present venues gaining a great global rep just on there sound alone.

Here is a comment on my facebook page on my designs, to show people do notice and pay attention to sound,

Jerimie Turner,
there is an entire old school tribe of Stereo Montreal dancers in Halifax Nova Scotia who pray to your audio every time they get together for social goodness. We know...... lol All kidding aside, pro-techs and dancers still pass around printouts of your specs and driver lists while yelling and moving at very loud parties. So yea..we're listening.

Sbs Shorty
your serious? wow

Jerimie Turner
totally serious. There was only one great record shop in Halifax in the bangin' days so the scene is tight. We did/do and will share SBS, no worries there. you've got friends over in the east side Shorty.


Where people really notice the quality of club x that has great sound is when they go to another venue and hear the same music on a diff system, then say wow this system doesnt sound like the other space and really realise how great sound is and have a better appreciation for it.

Last edited by soundmanshorty : 10-22-2010 at 11:22 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 10-31-2010, 09:37 PM
pbellsound pbellsound is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: NEW YORK CITY
Posts: 644
I had the pleasure of working with some of the fine crew that does Nathan's work. They were traveling with a Thrive amplifier. Good guys dem guys.

I suppose, if racked and handled properly, the amp will run on the road. Heavy I suppose compared to the rest of the market's offerings.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 11-09-2010, 09:31 PM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: New York
Posts: 430
Quote:
Originally Posted by NAVDEEP
How about the powersoft K20 9000 W @2ohn dual 5200@ 4 ohm dual. that should fit your power needs !!! actually has anyone used these amps ???

Thanks for the suggestion.

Yes. I've worked with Powersofts. They are very good amplifiers. I have friends in Trinidad that own a few K 20's that are used for Carnivals.

Purchasing amplifiers no lower than 3 decibels higher than 2000 watts per channel @ 4 ohms are my requirements so the K 20 does fit the description.

A reliable source has recommended an amplifier I was observing. Since that person's mentality falls under the same concepts as I, in addition to knowing the type of sound he prefers based on sharing thoughts on the quality of other large amplifiers/speakers, I've made up my mind on which amplifier(s) will suite my requirements.

There is a technical side as well, however I doubt you will understand what I would be discussing so I’ll just leave it at that.

Best Regards,
__________________
Elliot Thompson
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:49 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.0.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
©2006 Wave Music


© Wave Entertainment Group, Inc.