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-   -   Bryston 4b power sag? (http://www.wavemusic.com/community/showthread.php?t=13890)

DSA.audio 09-12-2013 11:56 AM

Bryston 4b power sag?
 
anyone with experience with these units?

I have a friend who says that it is 100% normal for this
amplifier to cause an installation site's ( regardless of physical location)
power to sag, causing lights to dim, etc....

thoughts?

Truba 09-13-2013 01:02 AM

i have a 4 bst, a guy in a shop told me they draw a lot of power from the power socket, thats probably why. i bought 4bst in early january this year, i needed a step down power transformer for it cause all my other ones were used on other gear, so i walk into a shop and ask this dude who sells all your electronic stuff, kinda like radio shack in the us but smaller, he says you need to look at the back of the amp and see how much it draws out, so i said i'll just bring it and you have a look at it, he says no worries.

so i drive home pick the amp up bring it down to the shop, a dude looks at it and goes man we dont sell stuff that supports that sorta power wtf is that man, he said that if i need to get a transformer its gonna cost me more than an amp, he said you have to modify the amp internally its gonna cost you a fortune, anyway their biggest power transformer was something like 400 aud, i didnt know what to do, he even said if i manage to find one it will never last more than 2 hours playing, it will overheat and switch off.

so i didnt know what to do i went on the net and bam first search, this massive power transformer for 169 dollars, i call the guys and he says yeah this one http://www.tortech.com.au/product/-sd110-1500a-16500-/
will do the job, he said it can work 24/7, he said these transformers are used for power tools like drills that are imported from the states, he said that it may be noisy but i havent had any issues with it, it works flawless and i can play as long as i want, i left it once for about day and a half and it didnt even get wam.

anyway my story :o

Elliot Thompson 09-13-2013 11:01 AM

The amplifier draws no more than any 250-watt class A/B amplifier. You are looking at a maximum of 15-17 amps short term on a 120-volt line source which, any household electrical circuit can manage.

Best Regards,

DSA.audio 09-13-2013 11:32 AM

Elliott,
that's what I was thinking... the demands wouldn't be much more than
a comparable design... and that a decently stable power supply shouldn't have an issue...

I think the main issue is that he lives in a hundred year old home, and it's not 100% sure of his electrical, as he did not personally do or obverse the renovation thereof...

DSA.audio 09-13-2013 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Truba
i have a 4 bst, a guy in a shop told me they draw a lot of power from the power socket, thats probably why. i bought 4bst in early january this year, i needed a step down power transformer for it cause all my other ones were used on other gear...

so i didnt know what to do i went on the net and bam first search, this massive power transformer for 169 dollars, i call the guys and he says yeah this one http://www.tortech.com.au/product/-sd110-1500a-16500-/
will do the job, he said it can work 24/7, he said these transformers are used for power tools like drills that are imported from the states, he said that it may be noisy but i havent had any issues with it, it works flawless and i can play as long as i want, i left it once for about day and a half and it didnt even get wam.

anyway my story :o



I'll post a pic of the one I bought to run a matamp mixer that swam to me a few years ago...

similar unit, but in reverse...

the one I grabbed was previously in use at a data center that had grabbed a slew of grey market servers to use for their hosting company....

Truba 09-13-2013 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elliot Thompson
The amplifier draws no more than any 250-watt class A/B amplifier. You are looking at a maximum of 15-17 amps short term on a 120-volt line source which, any household electrical circuit can manage.

Best Regards,


i could be wrong but at the back of mine it says 1350w, this is what it says in the manual;

Note: the 4B SST when operated with both channels delivering maximum power into 4 ohm loads, will consume all the available power in a normal household circuit, therefore a dedicated electrical circuit may be necessary with this situation.

Elliot Thompson 09-14-2013 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Truba
i could be wrong but at the back of mine it says 1350w, this is what it says in the manual;

Note: the 4B SST when operated with both channels delivering maximum power into 4 ohm loads, will consume all the available power in a normal household circuit, therefore a dedicated electrical circuit may be necessary with this situation.






Truba, download the manual for it states how much consumption the amplifier will consume at the given loads. Once you read it, you will see the amplifier consumes no more than a typical 250 watt per channel @ 8 ohms class AB amplifier.

By the way, 1350 watts is only 11.25 amperes on a 120-volt line source.

Best Regards,

Truba 09-14-2013 11:45 PM

thats the thing i have no idea about these things thats why i was hoping someone like you can explain these things a bit better to me. i was told that it draws out 1350 out of the wall, and the guy in a shop said its a lot of power to draw from the wall. anyway this is what the manual states

Power Consumption

At Idle - 170 watts

2 channels @ 300W @ 8 ohms - 1280 watts

2 channels @ 500W @ 4 ohms - 2100 watts

Bridged @ 900W @ 8 ohms - 2040 watts

btw i have no idea how much your typical 250 watt class a/b amp consumes




allen 09-15-2013 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSA.audio
I think the main issue is that he lives in a hundred year old home, and it's not 100% sure of his electrical, as he did not personally do or obverse the renovation thereof...


Sounds like it to me too. Given the age of the house perhaps that circuit is shared with some additional loads (he's already got the lights shared with it) that may be adding to the problem. The current requirements of that amp don't seam to crazy relative to other amps of that same size and comparable topology. How is the construction of the house is it hard to run a dedicated line for the setup?

Al

DSA.audio 09-15-2013 09:55 AM

Quote:

....WHEN THE AMPLIFIER FILLS UP IT'S CAPACITORS BECAUSE IT'S A TEMPORARY VOLTAGE SAG IN THE LINE THAT'S NORMAL FOR BRYSTON'S NO MATTER WHERE YOU USE THEM. TO MAKE SURE THAT IT DOESN'T REALLY HAVE AN EFFECT ON ANYTHING ELSE, I TURN THE BRYSTON ON FIRST LET IT DRAG DOWN THE VOLTAGE OF THE POWERLINE, THEN I TURN IT OFF IT TAKES UP TO TWO MINUTES FOR BRYSTON TO COMPLETELY DUMPED ITS POWER THEN I TURN ON THE MIXER AND QUICKLY TURN ON THE BRYSON AGAIN AND THEN I WON'T HAVE ANY VOLTAGE SAG....

Al, I'm not sure it has been investigated... Here's the reply I received when I questioned the mention of potential house lights flickering with his set up.

my friend went the other way and developed a very odd, IMHO at least, power up sequence.... :eek:

believing that this amplifier will dim any installation locations power, as I believe someone has told him sometime previously...

I do have some experience with this power sag phenomena,
but it was with car audio back a few years ago...

I have not experienced this in a home/industrial setting

Elliot Thompson 09-15-2013 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Truba
thats the thing i have no idea about these things thats why i was hoping someone like you can explain these things a bit better to me. i was told that it draws out 1350 out of the wall, and the guy in a shop said its a lot of power to draw from the wall. anyway this is what the manual states

Power Consumption

At Idle - 170 watts

2 channels @ 300W @ 8 ohms - 1280 watts

2 channels @ 500W @ 4 ohms - 2100 watts

Bridged @ 900W @ 8 ohms - 2040 watts

btw i have no idea how much your typical 250 watt class a/b amp consumes





The above numerical figures is the typical consumption of a 250 watt per channel @ 8 ohms Class A/B amplifier.

The above consumption next to the 4 and 8 ohms figures only comes into play when the amplifier is operating at maximum output (Clipping or just below clipping) at 4 and/or 8 ohms per channel. Wattage rating on amplifiers is rated at maximum output. Anything below maximum output the consumption will be less. It is similar to a hair dryer. The lower heater settings the lower the consumption, the higher the heater settings the higher the consumption.

The Idle Consumption of the amplifier is 170 watts, which is 1.4 amperes on a 120-volt line source. So the amplifier consumes,

At Idle - 170 watts ( 1.4 amperes on a 120-volt line source)

2 channels @ 300W @ 8 ohms - 1280 watts ( 10.6 amperes on a 120-volt line source)

2 channels @ 500W @ 4 ohms - 2100 watts ( 17.5 amperes on a 120-volt line source)

Bridged @ 900W @ 8 ohms - 2040 watts ( 17 amperes on a 120-volt line source)

This amplifier will operate fine on a standard 15 amp, 120-volt line source. Which is why, the manual recommends using nothing lower than a 15 amp, 120-volt line source.

Best Regards,

Truba 09-16-2013 04:13 PM

thanks for clearing that up mate, i always thought that 1350watts was being sucked out as soon as you started playing some music thru it:o

DSA.audio 09-16-2013 08:15 PM

it helps to have friends that share their thoughts and knowledge, when trying to understand all this stuff...
that's for sure!

Truba 09-17-2013 04:28 PM

it sure does

Lime Twig 09-19-2013 05:31 PM

very helpful, thanks, everyone.


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